Topic: Ginga Ninkyouden Bootleg Repair Log  (Read 3537 times)

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Offline Elgen

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Ginga Ninkyouden Bootleg Repair Log
« on: April 20, 2011, 12:37:11 AM »
I got this stack of 8-9 "untested" boards cheap about 2 years ago.
The defects (4 of them, it was) have just been stashed away in a box ever since my first test of them.
One of them was a bootleg Ginga Ninkyouden; a pretty frakked up beat'em'up by Jaleco.

A main and a secondary board connected with ribbons.

The backgrounds, text, sounds, controls and gameplay was good, but all the sprites were messed up.
It looked like the sprite-parts displayed fine, but in the wrong place.

Easy to see here in attract mode, where we have a line-up of most of the baddies starring in the game.


Also right upon start-up the message "RAM ERROR" was displayed very shortly (not easy to catch).


Okay, so started with the RAMs on the secondary board, as this is usually this one that handles graphics.
Started by shortening adjacent address and data pins on the different RAMs observing the screen.
That way I found RAMs used for colour, backgrounds, and texts, but no sprites.
Well it turned out, that the sprite RAMs were on the main board after all.

After having read GameDudes repair log on G'n'G over at Aussie (http://www.aussiearcade.com.au/showthread.php/20920-Ghost-n-Goblins) that also had misplaced sprites, I started poking the 273s on the main board.
Soon I found, that the one at V7 had both pin 12 and 13 stuck at high, while all the other in- and output were very active when there was sprites on screen.


As both in- and output were stuck, I began to trace what was happening upstream and found the output of a 244 at N8, aaaand BINGO! Found rot around the corresponding input pin.

(At this point, my hands were shakey and my palms moist, had I found my first REAL arcade hardware bug?)

By beeping, I found, that all the remaining inputs were tied to a an in-/output on the 245 just next to it at M8.
Only one was not (the plot thickens, MUAHAHAHA!). Tried to connect the two pins by just poking a piece of wire at both, and viola: All sprites back to normal!


Fired up the soldering iron and made a hook-up on the solderside, as this side is inside the sandwich when the two boards are combined with legs.


Now the game works perfectly. I still get the "RAM ERROR" message at start-up tho, but as the game seems to be working, I don't quite know what to make of that?!

I consider this case closed...my first REAL arcade repair };-P
« Last Edit: April 20, 2011, 10:16:19 AM by Elgen »

Offline Womble

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Re: Ginga Ninkyouden Bootleg Repair Log
« Reply #1 on: April 20, 2011, 12:43:40 AM »
Cool - your first real fix! Replacing missing ROMs and fixing squashed caps is one thing, but successfully troubleshooting logic is quite another - top work!  8)

LS273s are actually very useful for narrowing down whats certain parts of the board are doing, if you short the clock on pin 11 to pin 12 you will upset the whole chip and then its a case if seeing what goes crazy.
Sic Transit Gloria Atari

Offline Elgen

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Re: Ginga Ninkyouden Bootleg Repair Log
« Reply #2 on: April 20, 2011, 12:48:41 AM »
Thnx m8! Still totally high and having trouble hitting the keyboard as my arms is still stuck above my head };-P

Have you got any idea as to why I still get the "RAM ERROR" at start-up?
« Last Edit: April 20, 2011, 07:16:39 AM by Elgen »

Offline Womble

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Re: Ginga Ninkyouden Bootleg Repair Log
« Reply #3 on: April 20, 2011, 08:34:04 AM »
Have you got any idea as to why I still get the "RAM ERROR" at start-up?

Its hard to tell as it is a bootleg, it might just be an artifact of the code running on a board it was not written for, or you might have a fault, it really depends what the startup test is actually doing. Is this game available in MAME as a bootleg? You might find it does the same thing there.
Sic Transit Gloria Atari

Offline Elgen

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Re: Ginga Ninkyouden Bootleg Repair Log
« Reply #4 on: April 20, 2011, 08:38:07 AM »
Is this game available in MAME as a bootleg?
As far as I've been able to find, there are two rom sets...none of them matches my ROMs...but haven't dived deeper into it.

Offline porchy

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Re: Ginga Ninkyouden Bootleg Repair Log
« Reply #5 on: April 20, 2011, 11:38:40 AM »
well done mate. It's a great feeling isn't it.

Offline Elgen

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Re: Ginga Ninkyouden Bootleg Repair Log
« Reply #6 on: April 20, 2011, 11:48:55 AM »
Yes, and a bit dangerous too. Last night I was so ecstatic that "accidently" bought an original Konami Gryzor/Contra };-P
« Last Edit: April 20, 2011, 01:35:53 PM by Elgen »

Offline Panther

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Re: Ginga Ninkyouden Bootleg Repair Log
« Reply #7 on: April 20, 2011, 12:35:44 PM »
Yes, and a bit dangerous too. Last night I was ecstatic that "accidently" bought an original Konami Gryzor/Contra };-P

@Womble & Porchy - I think he's gotten the bug  :)

Offline Elgen

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Re: Ginga Ninkyouden Bootleg Repair Log
« Reply #8 on: April 20, 2011, 12:37:18 PM »
Please, just give me another fix, pleeeeease };-P

Offline porchy

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Re: Ginga Ninkyouden Bootleg Repair Log
« Reply #9 on: April 20, 2011, 04:08:32 PM »
Yes, and a bit dangerous too. Last night I was ecstatic that "accidently" bought an original Konami Gryzor/Contra };-P

@Womble & Porchy - I think he's gotten the bug  :)

Its a well known but little understood bug too. I don't know if recovery is even possible

Offline Elgen

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Re: Ginga Ninkyouden Bootleg Repair Log
« Reply #10 on: April 20, 2011, 04:43:25 PM »
Please fill me in on this "bug" };-D

Offline porchy

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Re: Ginga Ninkyouden Bootleg Repair Log
« Reply #11 on: April 20, 2011, 04:45:35 PM »
Please fill me in on this "bug" };-D

Once you start repairing/collecting its impossible to stop yourself
  :D

Offline Elgen

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Re: Ginga Ninkyouden Bootleg Repair Log
« Reply #12 on: April 20, 2011, 04:55:14 PM »
Quote
I am a young fool. Only now, at the end, do I understand. My feeble skills are no match for the power of the Dark PCBs! I have paid the price for my lack of vision!
I afraid my faith is forever sealed now!
« Last Edit: April 20, 2011, 04:58:24 PM by Elgen »

Offline Elgen

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Re: Ginga Ninkyouden Bootleg Repair Log
« Reply #13 on: April 20, 2011, 05:08:14 PM »
Btw the hookup wire I used, is not quite thin enough i think.
What do you use for hookups?

Offline porchy

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Re: Ginga Ninkyouden Bootleg Repair Log
« Reply #14 on: April 20, 2011, 09:37:44 PM »
Do a search for kynar wire, I think its 30AWG. It's cheap enough and does last quite a while unless your doing mega amounts of repairs